GEOFF BENNETT: Now to our interview with Finland's President Alexander Stubb.

We spoke this morning in New York during this week's U.N.

General Assembly.

As the leader of a NATO nation that shares an 830-mile border with Russia, Stubb has been a key voice in Europe's response to the war in Ukraine.

In a speech to the U.N.

Security Council this past week, he welcomed what he called an apparent shift in tone on Ukraine and Russia by President Trump.

I asked him, given the contradictory statements by the Trump administration on the war, including the claim that Ukraine will be able to win back territory now under Russian control, why he believes President Trump's latest words carry weight.

ALEXANDER STUBB, President of Finland: My first observation is that never underestimate the capacity of President Trump to negotiate a deal.

I think peace mediation is always incremental.

You go step by step.

Sometimes, it's two steps forward, one step back.

I think what I have found in this eight months is that we have had a process.

First, there's been a lot of carrot.

So you try to get -- convince Putin to come to the negotiating table.

And when you see that the carrot is not necessarily working, you put down a stick.

And what we saw on Tuesday was a big statement from the president.

GEOFF BENNETT: Do you think Vladimir Putin perceives Donald Trump to be strong?

I mean, there are dispassionate observers who say that President Trump has avoided holding Vladimir Putin accountable.

ALEXANDER STUBB: Well, I can't go into the head of President Putin, but, of course, looking at the track record of President Trump, I'm sure, as a Russian president, I'd be worried.

When he says that the Russian economy is not doing well or that the Russian military has made a strategic mistake and they should pay for it, I mean, I'm sure the Kremlin is listening.

So I do think that the Kremlin sees President Trump as a strong president.

GEOFF BENNETT: The Polish prime minister, Donald Tusk, in a tweet said that: "Behind Trump's optimism lies a promise of reduced U.S.

involvement and a shift of responsibility for ending the war to Europe."

Do you see it that way?

ALEXANDER STUBB: No, I see it as teamwork.

So, basically, before Alaska, we had a lot of conversations with the president.

He comes back from Alaska, we continued the conversations in the White House.

And, at that stage, we decided, OK, let's start working on security guarantees for Ukraine.

They're pretty much a done deal now.

Then, after that, he, I would say correctly, says, you need to stop buying Russian oil and gas.

We point the finger at Hungary and Slovakia.

So that puts pressure on Europe.

But I don't see it at all as an off-ramp.

I think that's a wrong analysis.

I think it's very much teamwork.

And the only person that can end this war is President Trump.

GEOFF BENNETT: So this isn't President Trump washing his hands, essentially?

ALEXANDER STUBB: No, no.

I don't see that at all, because, if you look at President Trump's engagement just during this U.N.

week in different types of peace mediation, earlier, it was about Azerbaijan and Armenia.

It's been obviously about Israel and Palestine.

So he has a lot of things going on.

And one can focus on only so many things at a time.

GEOFF BENNETT: If the U.S.

commitment wavers again, how will Finland how will Europe insulate Ukraine from that uncertainty?

ALEXANDER STUBB: Well, we work on it together.

So there are many different elements.

I mean, first, we need to continue the financial support.

And, of course, Europe is doing a lion's share of that, together with the United States.

Secondly, we need to continue the military support in terms of equipment, in terms of co-production, in terms of ammunition.

And then, thirdly, we need to continue to keep the financial pressure up on Russia.

And the E.U., the European Union, just issued its 19th sanction package.

So we need to sort of maximize the pressure on Putin, which would then switch his strategic game, because he hasn't changed his strategic game.

That is still to deny the independent sovereignty and territorial integrity of Ukraine.

If he understands that Europeans and Americans are united to support Ukraine, he will probably change tack.

GEOFF BENNETT: How do the airspace violations play into Putin's strategic game, to use your phrase?

Russia, over the past few weeks, has violated the airspace of Estonia, of Poland, has violated Finnish airspace over the last few years.

What do you think they're up to?

ALEXANDER STUBB: Russia is testing us.

They are conducting two types of warfare.

One is kinetic, classic.

That's what we see in Ukraine.

And the other one is hybrid.

And they're testing us on land, air and sea.

So, on land, a year, year-and-a-half ago, they kept on sending asylum seekers, basically instrumentalizing them at our border, which is a heinous crime.

But we put up legislation to deter that.

Then, over the winter, on Christmas Day, they cut cables in the Baltic Sea.

We put up the Baltic "Sentry" operation -- quote, unquote -- by NATO.

So they have stopped that.

And now they're testing us in the air.

We put the Eastern Sentry from the alliance.

In my mind, in these situations, you kind of have to be Finnish.

So stay calm.

The more you prepare, the less likely he's -- they're to continue.

GEOFF BENNETT: You have said that Ukraine, when it engages in peace talks, should start from a position of strength.

What does that look like in practical terms?

ALEXANDER STUBB: Well, in practical terms, it looks like pretty much the following.

One, they have security guarantees.

So they take full responsibility of their own security, but they're supported by Europe and given a backstop from the U.S.

Secondly, they have enough military equipment so that Russia understands that they can be hit, let's say, by long-range drones, which hit their strategic bombers up close to Murmansk, 3,000, 4,000 kilometers away from Ukraine, and then, finally, that at the end of the day, Ukraine will never become Russian.

It becomes European, a member of the European Union, eventually hopefully a member of NATO in the long run.

And that, I think, would give them a position of strength.

GEOFF BENNETT: Given Finland's position on the border with Russia, how do you balance deterrence with diplomacy?

ALEXANDER STUBB: Right now, unfortunately, we don't have much diplomacy on a political level because of the situation, but we do, of course, have diplomats discussing and we have practical arrangements.

You see, Finland joined NATO not against Russia, but just to protect ourselves.

The opinion polls in Finland changed overnight, or actually over three nights.

Now NATO membership has 80 percent support.

How do we continue the deterrence?

Well, do what we have been doing.

We have obligatory military service; 900,000 men and women have done it.

We have 280,000 in reserves for wartime.

We have over 60 F-18s.

We just bought 64 F-35s.

We have the biggest artillery in Europe together with Poland.

And, as I always say, we don't have it because we're worried about Stockholm.

GEOFF BENNETT: When this administration asks, what is Europe doing to maintain and to provide for Ukraine's security, what's Finland's answer?

ALEXANDER STUBB: Well, our answer is that, per capita, we are the fifth or sixth biggest provider of support to Ukraine when it comes to finance, when it comes to military equipment, when it comes to ammunition.

And I also want to see basically the eastern flank starting from the high north from Norway through Finland, the Baltic states, a little bit of an interim with Belarus, and then Ukraine is about 5,000 kilometers.

The biggest armies in Europe pretty much right now are Turkey, Ukraine and Poland and Finland.

So we have got the eastern flank covered.

GEOFF BENNETT: President Stubb, thanks again.

We appreciate it.

ALEXANDER STUBB: My pleasure.