♪♪ >> Cathy: THE MINNEAPOLIS ST. PAUL INTERNATIONAL FILM FESTIVAL IS RIGHT AROUND THE CORNER.

ONE OF THE DOCUMENTARIES PREMIERING THIS YEAR IS THE WORK OF MINNESOTA FILMMAKER NORAH SHAPIRO.

"MAGIC AND MONSTERS" FOLLOWS A DECADES-OLD SEXUAL ABUSE SCANDAL AT THE CHILDREN'S THEATRE COMPANY IN MINNEAPOLIS AND FOLLOWS SURVIVORS WHO BREAK THEIR SILENCE DECADES LATER WE'RE GOING TO TALK WITH NORAH SHAPIRO IN JUST A FEW MINUTES BUT FIRST HERE'S A LOOK AT THE MOVIE TRAILER.

>> THE LARGEST CHILDREN'S THEATER IN THE WORLD IT TURNS OUT IT IN THE MINNEAPOLIS-ST. PAUL AREA.

>> CHILDREN'S THEATER WAS A NATIONAL GEM.

>> IT WAS THE MOST MAGICAL, UNBELIEVABLE PLACE WHERE THINGS HAPPENED THAT YOU COULD ONLY SEE IN FAIRY TALES.

>> NOW I LOOK BACK AT IT AND I'M HORRIFIED.

♪♪ >> THERE WAS A BUNCH OF EXCEEDINGLY BRIGHT KIDS WHO WERE BROUGHT INTO THIS PROFESSIONAL THEATER AND WE WERE ALL TOLD WE ARE SPECIAL.

>> ARTS COURSES.

SINGING, ACTING, DANCE.

>> WE ARE ABOUT CREATING SACRED MOMENTS AND MAGIC.

>> PART OF WHAT MADE IT SO SPECIAL IS JOHN CLARK DONAHUE.

>> HE WAS TEACHING US, ALWAYS.

INTRODUCING US TO ART, OUR MINDS WERE BEING EXPANDED.

>> AND THEN.

>> I SENSED THIS EROTIC ENERGY FOR DANGER.

♪♪ >> I HEARD THE RUMORS ABOUT JOHN DONAHUE.

>> THE NYMPHS OF THE ISLES.

>> THE MINNESOTA BUREAU OF CRIMINAL APPREHENSION INVESTIGATED COMPLAINTS THAT STUDENTS WERE BEING ABUSED.

>> OUR LOVE OF ART KEPT US THERE.

>> PEOPLE STARTED TELLING THEIR STORIES AND IT WAS JUST LIKE THIS OH, MY GOD, I HAD NO IDEA.

>> YOU WERE LOOKING AT A TIP OF THE ICEBERG.

>> WEALTHY INFLUENTIAL PEOPLE OF POSITIONS WERE VERY RELUCTANT THAT THIS INVESTIGATION WOULD GO FORWARD.

>> DENIAL IS SUCH N EASY THING TO CHOOSE.

>> THERE ARE INDICATIONS THAT OTHER STAFF MEMBERS MAY HAVE BEEN SEXUALLY ABUSING CHILDREN OVER A PERIOD OF MANY YEARS.

>> THEY DIDN'T WANT TO BELIEVE THAT THIS WAS MANY, MANY PERPETRATORS, MANY MANY VICTIMS.

>> I HAD TOLD THE TRUTH, IT COSTS ME EVERYTHING THAT WAS IMPORTANT TO ME.

>> SING TO ME!

>> THE THINGS THAT HAPPENED IN THAT ROOM.

>> IT WAS SHOCKING.

>> INSTITUTIONS MAKE THEMSELVES COMPLICIT IN THE HOPE THAT THESE PROBLEMS WILL GO AWAY, THAT THESE MEMORIES WILL GO AWAY, THAT THIS HISTORY WILL GO AWAY.

IT'S A SECOND WORLD.

>> THE AVERAGE VICTIM NEEDS DECADES TO COME FORWARD.

YOU HAVE TO BE AN ADULT TO UNDERSTAND THAT YOUR CHILDHOOD WAS DESTROYED.

>> IT COULD HAVE BEEN SAFE AND IT SHOULD HAVE BEEN SAFE.

>> SURVIVORS COME FORWARD BECAUSE THEY WANT CHILDREN PROTECTED AND THEY WANT INSTITUTIONS TO CHANGE.

>> THAT EVERYBODY KNEW THIS WAS HAPPENING AT THE THEATER.

NOBODY DID ANYTHING.

♪♪ >> Cathy: JOINING US TO TALK MORE ABOUT "MAGIC AND MONSTERS, FILM'S DIRECTOR NORAH SHAPIRO.

WELCOME BACK TO THE SHOW IT'S BEEN AWHILE.

>> IT'S A PLEASURE TO SEE YOU BOTH, THANKS FOR HAVING ME.

>> Cathy: ABSOLUTELY.

PEOPLE PROBABLY DON'T EVEN REMEMBER THIS STORY, IT WAS A HUGE STORY BACK THEN.

AND DONAHUE WAS KIND OF LIKE A SVENGALI FIGURE, WASN'T HE?

WILDLY CREATIVE, KIND OF A MYSTERIOUS SORT OF INDIVIDUAL, THOUGH.

HOW WITH YOU DESCRIBE HIM?

>> WELL, I DIDN'T KNOW HIM PERSONALLY ALTHOUGH I WILL SAY I GREW UP ATTENDING THE CHILDREN'S THEATER.

IT AFFECTED MY ARTISTIC SENSIBILITIES, IT WAS RADICALLY, AMAZINGLY OWERFUL THEATER.

IT WAS BEAUTIFUL, UNPARALLELED ART.

AND HE WAS BEHIND THAT.

AND UNFORTUNATELY THERE WAS ALSO ANOTHER DARKER SIDE TO WHAT WAS HAPPENING.

>> Eric: IS IT FAIR TO CALL THIS A COVER-UP?

>> OH, BOY, THAT'S -- UM.

I WOULD SAY IT'S A LITTLE MORE COMPLICATED THAN THAT.

LIKE THE WHOLE STORY IS.

OUR FILM AND PROBABLY ANY TELLING OF THIS.

THE OTHER THING I WOULD SAY AND I THINK IS REALLY IMPORTANT FOR THE PUBLIC TO UNDERSTAND IS I'VE OFTEN USED THE ANALOGY OF A DISCO BALL THAT HAS MANY MANY MANY COUNTLESS FACETS, AND THIS FILM IS ONE.

THERE'S SO MANY PEOPLE WHO WERE AFFECTED AND IMPACTED IN THIS COMMUNITY ON ALL SIDES, WHETHER FROM THE AUDIENCE, WHETHER FROM THE INSTITUTION, WHETHER THEY WERE STUDENTS, WHETHER THEY WERE CLASSMATES.

IT'S A VERY COMPLICATED STORY AND COMPLICATED LEGACY.

>> Cathy: WAS IT TOUGH TO GET PEOPLE TO TALK?

>> THAT'S A GOOD QUESTION.

YES AND NO I WOULD SAY.

WE WERE INVITED IN TO TELL THIS STORY, AND THE STORY IS VERY SPECIFICALLY FROM THE LENS FROM THE PERSPECTIVE OF THE LITIGATION THAT TOOK PLACE AS A RESULT OF MINNESOTA PASSED A TEMPORARY THREE-YEAR LOOKBACK, STATUTE OF LIMITATIONS REFORM AND IN FACT MINNESOTA AS IT OFTEN IS, WAS ON THE FRONT END.

IT WAS MAYBE THE FOURTH, THIRD OR FOURTH STATE IN THE NATION TO DO THAT.

AND OUT OF THAT, THIS LITIGATION CAME.

AND SO THAT WAS THE LENS.

SO THE PEOPLE WHO INITIATED THE CONVERSATION, IT WAS NOT HARD TO GET THOSE PEOPLE TO TALK TO ME, ALTHOUGH EVEN THAT WAS A COMPLICATED TRUST-BUILDING PROCESS THROUGHOUT.

>> Cathy: THERE'S A LOT OF TRAUMA INVOLVED.

>> SO MUCH TRAUMA INVOLVED.

BUT OTHER PEOPLE DIDN'T WANT TO TALK AT ALL.

PEOPLE WHO IT WOULD HAVE BEEN WONDERFUL TO HAVE THEIR VOICES REPRESENTED, BUT I COULD ONLY WORK WITH THE PEOPLE WHO WERE WILLING TO BE A PART OF IT.

>> Eric: WELL, YOU MUST HAVE HAD EMPATHY FOR THESE FOLKS.

YOU'VE GOT A BACKGROUND AS A DEFENSE ATTORNEY AND PUBLIC DEFENDER.

SO DID YOU USE SOME OF THOSE SKILLS AS A TRUST BUILDING MECHANISM, OR?

>> I WOULD -- I MEAN, I'M SURE I DID.

I MEAN, I WOULD SAY I HAVE EMPATHY FOR EVERYBODY INVOLVED ON ANY LEVEL IN THIS WHAT IS A REALLY TRAGIC STORY.

>> Eric: DID YOU GATHER THEM TOGETHER OR DID YOU DO THE INTERVIEWS SEPARATELY OR, WITH THE VICTIMS?

>> I WOULD SAY BOTH, BOTH OF THOSE THINGS TOOK PLACE OVER -- I MEAN, THIS WAS A LONG TIME.

WHEN WE STARTED OUT, WE STARTED THE PROCESS IN 2019, AS WE ALL KNOW WHAT WAS JUST COMING AROUND THE CORNER THAT CHANGED SO MUCH, THAT CHANGED FILMMAKING, SOME OF THE FILM, SOME OF THE SHOOTS WERE DONE REMOTELY WITH THE COVID PROTOCOLS AT THE TIME AND ACROSS THE COUNTRY.

MASKS, NOT MASKS.

IT REALLY EVOLVED.

THINGS TOOK LONGER THAN I THINK WE INITIALLY ANTICIPATED IN PART BECAUSE OF THE SHUTDOWN AND EVERYTHING ELSE THAT WE'VE GONE THROUGH.

BUT IT WAS N ONGOING PROCESS.

>> Cathy: HOW MUCH INSTITUTIONAL COURAGE DID THE CHILDREN'S THEATRE COMPANY SHOW THROUGH ALL THIS?

>> WELL, WAY O PUT ME ON THE SPOT.

YOU KNOW, I COULD ANSWER HAT DIFFERENTLY BASED ON DIFFERENT POINTS ALONG THE TIMELINE.

I THINK, THOUGH, THAT WHAT I WOULD RATHER SAY ABOUT THAT IS I THINK I'D LOVE FOR AUDIENCES TO MAKE UP THEIR OWN MINDS ABOUT THAT BECAUSE WHAT WE REALLY TRIED HARD TO DO IS TO THOROUGHLY AND CAREFULLY REPORT AND INVESTIGATE AND SUBJECT IT TO RIGOROUS FACT-CHECKING AND CARE, TELL OF THE STORY.

AND THERE'S A LOT OF BIG FEEL OH, MY GOODNESS ALL SIDES AND IT'S EASY TO LOOK BACKWARD AND ANSWER A QUESTION LIKE THAT.

I THINK, THOUGH, THAT THERE'S A LOT OF THINGS THAT CAN BE LEARNED AND THAT'S ONE OF THE PURPOSES, ONE OF THE REASONS FOR MAKING THE FILM.

>> Eric: WHERE AND WHEN TO SEE IT?

>> THE FILM, IT'S CREENING, IT'S PREMIERING, IN FACT AT THE MINNEAPOLIS-ST. PAUL INTERNATIONAL FILM FESTIVAL.

>> Eric: DO YOU KNOW WHAT DAY?

>> YES, WE, THE FIRST SCREENING IS ON APRIL 7TH, I'M BOTH HAPPY AND SAD FOR PEOPLE WHO DON'T HAVE TICKETS TO SAY THAT IT SOLD OUT VERY QUICKLY, IT WAS MOVED TO A BIGGER THEATER AND THAT SOLD OUT.

THERE ARE AS I UNDERSTAND TICKETS STILL LEFT FOR THE SECOND SCREENING ON THE NINTH, 4:15 ON THE NINTH.

>> Eric: ST. ANTHONY MAIN?

>> YES.

>> Cathy: YOU REALLY DID AMAZING WORK, YOU AND YOUR